Post by Administrator on Nov 30, 2019 10:37:08 GMT
Update*
READ AND STUDY THIS ENTIRE THREAD (20+ pages currently) AND CONTEMPLATION ON IT BEFORE YOU COME TO YOUR CONCLUSIONS. ***IMPORTANT***
Modern Human Rights lawyers for extinction Rebellion are NOT getting this right at the moment.. as if they were, half the Human Rights lawyer's would be out of buisness and more courts shutting down.
Best clear the brain fog too.
They just haven't been paid to research and understand the history behind it.
The 1688 law of the Right to Petition does not create "the right to do it"
The means or authority merely to petition the government.
Petitioning was already well established and historically critical, frequently used and implemented into English proceedings and Government in connection with the Citizens.
What the 1688 law does, without question or contest introduces the "protection" the special immunity from the lower courts. Granted to the Citizens when brining Greivences, complaints, disputes and appeals or requests for new laws or changes in law - to Government Jurisdiction for debate, decision.
That is the entire point and purpose of the affirmation of petitioning important place in English law
Through this thread I will put together material of why that is, and how.
To understand the validity & importance enabling us to fully recognize & accept the "Right to petition" we need to explore it in its context & history leading upto & around the time of its creation and assent & the time shortly afterwards
Not all people vote for and support this government.
True that we are meant to abide by the laws.
But that is why we have them so people follow rules.
But with only 2/3 people who vote...
The government really is only as popular and strong as how many people support it. Not how many people have the laws imposed upon them, who don't vote.
Its therefore encouraged to support the government.
If it was 2/3 people who did NOT vote for the government... the majority would be opposed to the government and it would be weak. In fact it would have difficulty in governing and imposing laws.
So, to encourage the Subjects to actually vote for and join , engage the government with its system...
Its desirable to get people interested in politics and come with fresh ideas and laws and join in....
This increases the supporters of the government and interest in the system and abiding by laws by actually participating in making them.
Come to the government with your ideas. Don't refuse to vote. Refuse to subscribe to the government.
Actually don't come with war... weapons..
Come with ideas. Laws. And interest.
And in doing so you are raised up with various ideas...
Subjects that you peruse on behalf of the government.
Example of Early "rites" cultures Gunderstrup Cauldron between 150 BC and 1 BC late La Tène period
Obviously most people work but still can think. And have free time to volunteer..
We need an advocate who can represent us in parliament but are free to voice and send our ideas from afar.. by paper or other mediums...
Advocates can form parties. Franchises.
Where by many people agree to the same ideas.
But there are independent Ministers who advocate for their constituents thoughts and will..
This would have been a great way to get people into politics, especially when even less people could read and write. Or didn't support the government.. particularly when it was not as elaborately decorated as it is in the modern day... with gold and symbolism...
When it was more laws and taxes oriented and less open to the public participation...
So...
A right to come to the government with ideas, not with war and weapons... was a very appealing idea.
Because by actually supporting and voting, joining in with the government, you are not a non voter and not opposing the government.
The more voters, the better...
Because the more people are joined up to the government.
Many people dont care about ideas and are happy to do whatever other people think of. So they are less interested in petitioning.. but if they could be persuaded to support the Petitions and ideas by signing them.. or choosing their preferred advocate Minister . They still are supporting and "in" on the government.
Otherwise if nobody voted at all... the government would be in a poor position for governing as really that government might get overthrown.
Particularly if only 1/3 people voted for it. It would not have the physical ability to administration.. against a larger number of people..
Therefore...
The best way to avoid war. Battles in steel and army's, and on the battlefield in civil war..
Is to raise the battles to ideas. Principles, theory...
If people are given the right to contest ideas, without any physical war, battles, fights, chains, arrests..
People agree to support and follow and subscribe to the government. And they in fact participate and join in...
Everyone working together.. to put forward ideas, Subjects, laws, which are then debated, contested in parliament... and implemented..
This is good because there are no more wars on the battlefield.
The contests are in ideas and the Subjects.
Which is much more civilised and safer and stable than battle on the streets because of the disruption it would cause to daily life.
The right to Petition carry special privilege of in fact protection from the law.... provided that it is because a person is pursuing a subject. They are in pursuance of a subject. A cause.
They are working on ideas and Interests, engaging with the government system.
This is desirable.
They are not at war with the government at physical arms. They are choosing to vote for and support the government and contest ideas.
The government Grant's the Subjects protection from punishment.. through legal protections from the courts... when pursuing these Subjects they are petitioning about... because parliament is the authority the highest jurisdiction where those Subjects and all facts and circumstances are to be debated/decided.
Not in courts.
In parliament.
So if you are a supporter of this government in pursuance of a subject you are entitled to protection from the law, while pursuing that subject in order to bring the matter to parliament where our advocates debate it for us.
Be them independent or franchise groups of advocates...
Obviously the media can influence people's decisions a lot as can the franchises such as labour, conservative or organisations that can put Bill's forward for petition such as McDonald's or Burger King... if they can rally a big enough appetite for supporting their causes..
They may get favour and extra rewards for pleasing the government with their appetite for success especially if they can get special decorations and rewards.. they will carry great weight and favour of the regal kind...
Charities also give great favour to regal recognition provided that they have those willing to give their lives to the charitable causes... food banks and such or just helping volunteering all week or a number of days ..
We are all given the right, to have our say and ask the government to change the laws. Make new laws or complain about things we are not happy about..
If we feel we are being taken advantage of by the franchises or laws.. we can Petition for change or remedy.. particularly to any I'll appetite the party franchises have that is distasteful to us and has I'll effect on our lives.. careers, driving licences, vocations...
We will need to peruse that subject and obtain proof, evidence and get public support so that the matter can be debated in parliament.
For this.. our Subjects are fought in ideas and contest in parliament, under this government. System.
Not against it on the battlefield in war.
We vote for the government and actually work to get more people to vote for and support this government by supporting our Subjects and causes and remedy.
We are granted protection from the courts in pursuance of these Subjects.
Because we are bringing subject to the highest authority... parliament where all facts and circumstances pertaining to this subject will be heard and decided.
Do you understand, this right?
DJ Watson of Leicestershire?
Everyone's ideas, subjects, opinions, thoughts and complaints are being dipped into the debate pot, in parliament.
and in this we all subscribe to the British Government. By being voters.
Those who choose to pursue a subject for the purpose of brining it to parliament for our advocates (ministers) to decide on... enjoy special protection from the courts while in pursuit of these subjects they are petitioning.
READ AND STUDY THIS ENTIRE THREAD (20+ pages currently) AND CONTEMPLATION ON IT BEFORE YOU COME TO YOUR CONCLUSIONS. ***IMPORTANT***
Modern Human Rights lawyers for extinction Rebellion are NOT getting this right at the moment.. as if they were, half the Human Rights lawyer's would be out of buisness and more courts shutting down.
Best clear the brain fog too.
They just haven't been paid to research and understand the history behind it.
The 1688 law of the Right to Petition does not create "the right to do it"
The means or authority merely to petition the government.
Petitioning was already well established and historically critical, frequently used and implemented into English proceedings and Government in connection with the Citizens.
What the 1688 law does, without question or contest introduces the "protection" the special immunity from the lower courts. Granted to the Citizens when brining Greivences, complaints, disputes and appeals or requests for new laws or changes in law - to Government Jurisdiction for debate, decision.
That is the entire point and purpose of the affirmation of petitioning important place in English law
Through this thread I will put together material of why that is, and how.
To understand the validity & importance enabling us to fully recognize & accept the "Right to petition" we need to explore it in its context & history leading upto & around the time of its creation and assent & the time shortly afterwards
Not all people vote for and support this government.
True that we are meant to abide by the laws.
But that is why we have them so people follow rules.
But with only 2/3 people who vote...
The government really is only as popular and strong as how many people support it. Not how many people have the laws imposed upon them, who don't vote.
Its therefore encouraged to support the government.
If it was 2/3 people who did NOT vote for the government... the majority would be opposed to the government and it would be weak. In fact it would have difficulty in governing and imposing laws.
So, to encourage the Subjects to actually vote for and join , engage the government with its system...
Its desirable to get people interested in politics and come with fresh ideas and laws and join in....
This increases the supporters of the government and interest in the system and abiding by laws by actually participating in making them.
Come to the government with your ideas. Don't refuse to vote. Refuse to subscribe to the government.
Actually don't come with war... weapons..
Come with ideas. Laws. And interest.
And in doing so you are raised up with various ideas...
Subjects that you peruse on behalf of the government.
Example of Early "rites" cultures Gunderstrup Cauldron between 150 BC and 1 BC late La Tène period
Obviously most people work but still can think. And have free time to volunteer..
We need an advocate who can represent us in parliament but are free to voice and send our ideas from afar.. by paper or other mediums...
Advocates can form parties. Franchises.
Where by many people agree to the same ideas.
But there are independent Ministers who advocate for their constituents thoughts and will..
This would have been a great way to get people into politics, especially when even less people could read and write. Or didn't support the government.. particularly when it was not as elaborately decorated as it is in the modern day... with gold and symbolism...
When it was more laws and taxes oriented and less open to the public participation...
So...
A right to come to the government with ideas, not with war and weapons... was a very appealing idea.
Because by actually supporting and voting, joining in with the government, you are not a non voter and not opposing the government.
The more voters, the better...
Because the more people are joined up to the government.
Many people dont care about ideas and are happy to do whatever other people think of. So they are less interested in petitioning.. but if they could be persuaded to support the Petitions and ideas by signing them.. or choosing their preferred advocate Minister . They still are supporting and "in" on the government.
Otherwise if nobody voted at all... the government would be in a poor position for governing as really that government might get overthrown.
Particularly if only 1/3 people voted for it. It would not have the physical ability to administration.. against a larger number of people..
Therefore...
The best way to avoid war. Battles in steel and army's, and on the battlefield in civil war..
Is to raise the battles to ideas. Principles, theory...
If people are given the right to contest ideas, without any physical war, battles, fights, chains, arrests..
People agree to support and follow and subscribe to the government. And they in fact participate and join in...
Everyone working together.. to put forward ideas, Subjects, laws, which are then debated, contested in parliament... and implemented..
This is good because there are no more wars on the battlefield.
The contests are in ideas and the Subjects.
Which is much more civilised and safer and stable than battle on the streets because of the disruption it would cause to daily life.
The right to Petition carry special privilege of in fact protection from the law.... provided that it is because a person is pursuing a subject. They are in pursuance of a subject. A cause.
They are working on ideas and Interests, engaging with the government system.
This is desirable.
They are not at war with the government at physical arms. They are choosing to vote for and support the government and contest ideas.
The government Grant's the Subjects protection from punishment.. through legal protections from the courts... when pursuing these Subjects they are petitioning about... because parliament is the authority the highest jurisdiction where those Subjects and all facts and circumstances are to be debated/decided.
Not in courts.
In parliament.
So if you are a supporter of this government in pursuance of a subject you are entitled to protection from the law, while pursuing that subject in order to bring the matter to parliament where our advocates debate it for us.
Be them independent or franchise groups of advocates...
Obviously the media can influence people's decisions a lot as can the franchises such as labour, conservative or organisations that can put Bill's forward for petition such as McDonald's or Burger King... if they can rally a big enough appetite for supporting their causes..
They may get favour and extra rewards for pleasing the government with their appetite for success especially if they can get special decorations and rewards.. they will carry great weight and favour of the regal kind...
Charities also give great favour to regal recognition provided that they have those willing to give their lives to the charitable causes... food banks and such or just helping volunteering all week or a number of days ..
We are all given the right, to have our say and ask the government to change the laws. Make new laws or complain about things we are not happy about..
If we feel we are being taken advantage of by the franchises or laws.. we can Petition for change or remedy.. particularly to any I'll appetite the party franchises have that is distasteful to us and has I'll effect on our lives.. careers, driving licences, vocations...
We will need to peruse that subject and obtain proof, evidence and get public support so that the matter can be debated in parliament.
For this.. our Subjects are fought in ideas and contest in parliament, under this government. System.
Not against it on the battlefield in war.
We vote for the government and actually work to get more people to vote for and support this government by supporting our Subjects and causes and remedy.
We are granted protection from the courts in pursuance of these Subjects.
Because we are bringing subject to the highest authority... parliament where all facts and circumstances pertaining to this subject will be heard and decided.
Do you understand, this right?
DJ Watson of Leicestershire?
Everyone's ideas, subjects, opinions, thoughts and complaints are being dipped into the debate pot, in parliament.
and in this we all subscribe to the British Government. By being voters.
Those who choose to pursue a subject for the purpose of brining it to parliament for our advocates (ministers) to decide on... enjoy special protection from the courts while in pursuit of these subjects they are petitioning.
